Bigots / Civil Partnership / Equalities / Gay Marriage / LGBT / Marriage / Turkey & Turkish

Goodbye to the Turkish Living Forum

The Turkish Living Forum has been hijacked by religious nutters and right wing bigots. I won’t be returning. And neither will many others judging by the private messages I’ve received. The tiresome exchange (well, mostly a fascist rant from the usual suspects) on UK marriage equality was allowed to shout on for three days. I’m not talking about people who oppose same sex marriage. That’s a difference of opinion, a legitimate example of free speech which I cherish. I’m referring to those who seem obsessed with man-on-man genital acts (always suspicious) as if being gay is all about sodomy (er, it isn’t) and those who were allowed to call for the extermination of gay people (Jawohl, mein Führer). Is this what the forum has been reduced to? Are the owners just in it for the hate money?

This offending comment was eventually removed by the moderators and the thread was then closed. Too little, too late, I’m afraid. The moderators were caught sleeping on the job. I will be watching from afar and if this hate campaign is allowed to continue, I will report it to the British Police as inciting hatred on the grounds of sexual orientation, a criminal offence in England and Wales since March 2010. Political correctness gone too far? Tough. You reap what you sow.

There are other forums to join such as Turkey Central and Turkish Life Forums where the discussion is more measured and actually about Turkish living.

Check out:

Same Sex Marriage in the UK

Much I Do About Nothing

34 thoughts on “Goodbye to the Turkish Living Forum

  1. That logo alone would constitute a criminal act in the UK. Thank you for giving a reason to be grateful for being here at a time when these are pretty thin on the ground [watching the news of Remploy being closed down literally as I type this].

  2. Ashley says,

    Well said.

    They will claim their misguided interpretation of “right to free speech” means they can say whatever they want with impunity.

    Free speech comes with responsibility. Responsibility not to incite, promote or spread, hatred, prejudice, fear etc, and this as you say is backed by law.

  3. Well Said!
    Forums play a really important role for expats, and I’ve received some great information via Turkish Living (.. a new Migros and a new road built near my house, as well as updates on the excavation work in Gumusluk.) There’s a couple of folks who provide a constant stream of photo’s to keep the rest of the “locals” informed, and it’s this collaborative approach that makes these forums invaluable.
    That being said – the forums should focus on sharing ideas and insights about the locale, and providing feedback to people who are seeking assistance about living or moving to the area, not about spewing bigoted ideas.
    If they want to do that, then surely there’s a forum out there they can join and spout their warped rhetoric… one automatically springs to mind…. http://www.Knob-R-us.com!

  4. It’s not a forum that I have frequented I’m pleased to say, and when you first mentioned this I wouldn’t have looked at it even out of curiosity because I know if I had read all this stuff I wouldn’t have been able to stop myself from having a go..and I won’t reduce myself to their level.
    As you say there are a few good expat forums out there…Turkey Central for example..good information and well moderated.
    There will always be trolls on any forum. There simply to stir up prejudice and hatred, and I’m shocked when you say that it took three days for it to be stopped.

  5. Could not agree more Jack – I made a resolution a long time ago not to get involved in TLF, and it seems, certain residents/visitors to Yalikavak are the worst offenders. Most of the time it is full of self-promotion for poor restaurants (always denied of course), do-gooders feeding the animals (until they return to UK) and petty bickering amongst those who think that they own the village – because they have been on holiday here !! There is more to life. Just wish certain TLF respondents would get one.

    • Lol, exactly, I am not aware of that forum but lived in Kusadasi and that is exactly what it is like, saddos with nothing to do but complain, self praise or self promote their businesses… moan central, Go Jack :)

  6. The internet, and by extension, social media venues, are such amazing developments, it’s hard to recall what life was like before them (although I’m certainly old enough). They provide an instant soapbox to anyone interested in participating in human discourse with others, sharing and clarifying views. The downside is that they are also open to those who don’t respect even a basic modicum of civility, as well as those who just plain hate (and don’t care who knows it). Too few people understand that you ought not type something that you wouldn’t say directly to someone’s face (and that you wouldn’t want attributed specifically to you in the major press). Just because the internet allows for a level of anonymous cowardice doesn’t mean people should make use of it. Sigh…

  7. Agree with you Jack 100%, I stopped contributing to the forum many months ago as I was fed up with the same old, same old comments all the time. The people who contribute to this forum on a daily basis, sometimes several times a day really need to get a life and stop interferring with everybody else’s !

    It used to be a great source of information, but, now if you ask a question you get several different answers, no one can agree and if you are not part of the “in crowd” you don’t even get an answer.

    Get a life I say and bugger the answer !

  8. Jack, I agree entirely. I was appalled at this thread – and others along similar lines – and very sad that a Forum I have enjoyed for many years has deteriorated to the point that I no longer read many of the threads. Racist, sexist, homophobic; rabid about religion, particularly Islam – who are these people? I feel fortunate that I’ll never meet them.

    I’m really sad that you are Liam are leaving Bodrum – fingers crossed I’ll be able to pop over to see you before you go!

  9. Thank you for everyone’s supportive comments on here, in emails and on facebook. I’ve heard that some people think I’ve gone over the top and should lighten up. Isn’t that what the Nazis said as they were shovelling Jews (and gay people, and others) into the ovens? Anyway, the point has been made and I shall leave the forum to the nutters. Tomorrow, something softer!

  10. It’s about time someone got that forum shut down!!!! There is no form of moderating what so ever, the comments are racist, libellous, intimidating and half the time things are made up purely to benefit the company that owns the forum!!! I got fed up of reading about bad restaurants, how poorly the ex-pats were treated and how every other builder or estate agent are con men and not to be trusted. One company that my friend new nearly went bust because of the lies they told on that forum and nobody did a thing apart from say you should have gone to the owners of this forum – which I have been told that this company is corrupt up to their back teeth, I love reading stuff about Turkey and have enjoyed many beautiful holidays there but never would I go on that forum again a lot of my Turkey friends have stopped viewing things on that forum purely because its worse than a soap opera and just so silly would be a nightmare to meet these people in real life!

  11. Hi Jack, your post was brought to my attention by a member of my own forum earlier today and although I did not see the offending material on Turkish Living, from what I know goes on there these days I am sorry to say that I am honestly not suprised people have begun to find some of the content offensive. The rot has been setting in for some time now and is what prompted me to start Turkish Life Forums.

    Thank you for highlighting my forum to your readers as a worthy alternative, as you know we are a small online community and we are trying grow and to be different.

    If anone feels that now is the time for a long overdue change of forum scenery then our friendly little community would be a welcome place to put down new roots and begin sharing knowledge about the country that brought everyone together in the first place.

    Good luck and best wishes, CrashTester.

    • You’re very welcome. I really hope people move across and participate. There are many good people on the TFL who don’t follow the cyber-bullies, pander to the partial people who run it or indulge in a kangeroo court mentality when faced with criticism.I’m sure they find a friendlier home at http://www.turkishlifeforums.com

  12. How very, very sad. I don’t know anything about this forum, but such things should be carefully moderated. NO, you have not gone over the top, and NO, you shouldn’t lighten up. This kind of bigotry and evil (to quote George W Bush) cannot be brushed over – like that comment Martin Luther King made about doing nothing and allowing it to happen. It won’t go away unless you stand up to it. You have your beliefs and principles, don’t back down. I support you 100 per cent and more. I KNOW and recognize this hatefulness, because it is all too common in Jamaica as you know – in fact you described it perfectly – at least as far as gay issues are concerned. And why does gay marriage get them so extra-incensed? It’s beyond me – and your references to the Nazis and the Jews are entirely appropriate I think. IS THE WORLD GOING BACKWARDS or is it my imagination? Look at the garbage these Republican candidates are spouting!??

  13. Actually I am disappointed in you reponse on your blog and your attitude. Of course some of the comments on the thread in question were totally offensive and went beyond the realm of decency. But, and it is a big but, you failed to say anything about the large majority of the comments in the thread condeming these remarks, and showing genuine concern and the right to “live and let let”, and sticking up for the rights of everyone. I have my own beliefs, and that is what they are, my own, and the decision on how one’s lives his or her life is exactly that, their own decision. Just like the many threads and comments that show a large anti-semite and anti-zionist view, or anti-American view, or the many anti-islamic views. I haven’t seen you screaming for the rights of these groups of people. To be fair, while you seem slighted, many others do to for other reasons and causes. The best defence against bigotry is in fact, the strong condemation on a free and open forum, which did happen. Only wish you would have given a thought to those, in the vast majority, including the mods, who have this view. Seems to me you looked at it all with tunnel vision. My thoughts anyways.

    • I’m sorry you’re disappointed. Sadly, I’m disappointed too. With free speech comes responsibility and I believe we should all be mindful of this. Forum rules should both reflect current hate legislation and be properly enforced. Comments be should moderated effectively. People should be warned when lines are crossed and banned when behaviour is not changed. None of these things are happening. I did not say every member is a bigot. It’s simply that this kind of discussion is too often dominated by a few cyber bullies who rant on without fear of restraint. We’ve been here before. It’s often personal and extremely unpleasant. If I felt that those who manage the forum would take their responsibilities seriously and less partially, I would be more than happy to re-engage. At the moment I see little point because the owners don’t accept that there is a problem. Perhaps it’s good for their business. Believe me I don’t say these things because it’s good for my business. Alienating people will hardly help with book sales.

      I’m sorry if there are people who are upset by what I’ve written in my personal blog and I know that there are many who have strongly condemned the rabid remarks of the few. It was remiss of me not to mention this in the post. But, honestly, I don’t know why they bother. This will happen again (as it has in the past) because the forum owners will let it.

  14. Jack, evil prevails when good people do nothing, and history proves this out. Much better to stick to your guns, and stand up for what is right and decent, like so many did on this thread. To turn a cold shoulder, sour the name of the forum and ask others to redirect to other Turkish forums seems a spot of grandstanding, as TLF has been very good to your blog and getting people to visit it. I just wish you would have looked at the big picture and had a bit more backbone to do what’s right, but it is your right to do as you see fit.

    • As you say, it’s my decision. I do think the criticism is completely mis-directed. I’m not ungrateful for the support that some members have shown the blog (for which thanks has always been given) but, really, this does rather underestimate the enormous time and effort I put into something that is now read all over the world.

  15. I totally agree with what Jack has said. And yes, TLF also has a large amount of anti-semitic remarks and people who bring in their Zionist conspiracy theories whether the thread is about Israel or the prices at Starbucks!!! It’s gotten almost absurd in that however a thread starts, it always finishes in Jew hating!
    Of course the anti-gay thread was allowed to run so long because it meant the forum was getting loads of clicks and bums on seats are good for business.
    Jack had to stand up and be counted, and in doing so, he represented anyone who has been subjected to these vile comments, whatever group they belong to. Words are not just words. If they were, then we would not have the laws of libel and slander and incitement to hatred. Many pogroms, genocides and hate crimes were started by vile books. Now, the internet has taken over.
    Of course there are some very decent and intelligent people on that forum but it takes only a very small number of bigots and trolls to hijack a forum simply because it is those people, and not the nice, decent ones, who have nothing else to do with their lives than spew venom.
    As the forum is supposed to be about Turkish living and not about Jew hating or Gay bashing or any other kind of unpleasantness, it should try to give that impression. It’s interesting that not a few people have noticed the flavour of the forum and its loudest posters. I do believe that one or two of them are trolls (ie not who they say they are) because the haters produce a stir and thus increase the website hits.
    More power to your elbows, Jack and Liam. I support you all the way!

  16. Obviously, the events and characters in this blog are fictitious.
    (ShirleyI have been told that this company is corrupt up to their back teeth)

    Is TLF still owned by a ( Gentleman) who originates from Pakistan .>> if so can someone ask him what happened to one of his moderators named Lee who decide to speak up against the bigots … R.I.P TLF

  17. I shall anwer my own question.
    Mushtaq your saying is aways follow the rules. is it not ? are you still associated with CrescentHomes, ?and Crescent HolidayRentals,? do you still own Turkish Living. are you still the ( Gentleman) who originates from Pakistan who owns a a small holiday home in Akbuk ..?How many times in one year do you visit Turkiye .?? Erm yes Mr Mushtaq it is spelt correctly //

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  20. I really don’t bother much with TLF myself these past few years ,, yes indeed it has been hijacked with those who so lov to read there own material and spill there bile onto the pages of the decent members still present … It is indeed a great pity as so many aare decent people with a common lov for the Turkish way of life and country ,, Now adays it sounds more like a version of ” Little Belfast” with the Irish and there we been done of by the brits all our life mentality !!! and yes I am from N.Ireland ….

    • So’s my Mum ;-). It is sad about the TLF and the hijack by the nasty little trolls who spew their poison from behind a silly handle. Most probably wouldn’t say boo to a goose in real life!

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